TP students petition for separate tables

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TP students petition for separate tables

by Joe Coughlin

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April 22, 2008

Seventh-grader Ryan Vandewiel didn't quite understand something during his lunch hour at Prairie View School in Tinley Park.

Muslim students at the school could sit at a separate table, away from other non-Muslim students, during Ramadan, which in 2007 was from Sept. 13 to Oct. 12.

During Ramadan, practicing Muslims fast from pre-dawn until sunset. Prairie View Principal Joel Martin said this separate table is available to ease the temptation for these kids and "to provide the best environment for the kids in the long-run."

Vandeweil saw it as segregation, and thought Catholic students should be able to have a separate table during the Lenten season, a 40-day stretch in which practicing Catholics abstain from eating meat on Fridays.

He started a petition and had around 100 students sign it. This was around the second or third week of Lent, according to Vandeweil and Martin.

"It wasn't so much that Catholics or I would feel tempted during Lent. I'm a vegetarian," the 13-year-old said. "I felt left out because there were separate tables offered to a different religion."

Benton said he met with one of the students behind with the petition and explained the purpose of the separate table.

He said the level of temptation between Catholics and Muslims during their respectful fasting seasons is not balanced because students of the Muslim faith cannot consume food or drink during the period between sun up and down. Catholics can have food and some of their other favorite consumptions, Martin said.

"It's a different level," he said. "If (Muslim students) have the late lunch, they could be going on six hours of not eating. Their time spent is best-spent not tempted. We just want to provide the best situation for these kids to focus the rest of the day."

Martin also explained how this was the first year a student of any other faith has asked for a separate table. And now that it has been brought up, administrators will get together and mull the options.

Though, he said, it is unlikely changes will be made.

Vandeweil sees it differently than Martin, however. He basically said temptation is relative, and reiterated that it was never really about temptation, but about segregation.

"I think that if someone is good in their faith they can (abstain) on their own, because they truly believe in what they are doing," he said. "Everybody should be offered a separate table for their beliefs or nobody should."

Principal Martin said there are about 15 Muslim students per lunch hour that are offered a separate table, but he noted not all choose to accept the table.

Martin added that the situation is still up for debate and will be looked at.

"We will have an open mind and listen to the arguments," he said.

Ryan
April 24, 2008 | 10:57 PM

Hey, it's Ryan Vandewiel from the article. I'd like to tell you more about what happened. Mr. Martin, the principal, called down a girl to relay a message to me. That's the person in the article that says Mr. Martin talked to. Still not an answer, but it's better than nothing. What Mr. Martin said to that person was, "If someone sitting next to you was eating a piece of balogna, would you be temped to eat it," followed by "We will consider it". Doubtful.

And it's not much "segregation" as much as it is discrimination. I wanted to test out my rights, and well, in America, your rights don't matter.

I respect Muslims who can fast that long 100%. I don't think I can do that. It's not the Muslim's fault, it's the administration's. I believe that it is part of the sacrafice. It's just like taking every piece of food off the face of the planet by puting them in separate tables. I am a vegan, and I live with meat and dairy around me every day, and I am not tempted, because I firmly believe that no animal should be used for food. But that is not religion. So I add stuff for me to do at Lent. There needs to be some sacrafice, for Catholics and Muslims.

Anyway, I came up with a plan for my school. But, as I said earlier, my opinions don't matter. How about a separate table is provided for anyone who wants it, all year? What if a student forgets his/her lunch? No table is provided. Just one table is provided every day throughout the year in the corner of the room for anyone. That, in my opinion, will solve the issue.

If nothing happens, here is my plan for next year. I will sit in the separate Muslim table, and when they tell me to move, I will ask why. They will say, "Because you're not Muslim". And I will still sit there because I have just as much a right as everybody else does. I'll say I'm Muslim for a day if it comes to that. Mr. Martin said himself, though, that it is "unlikely" that anything will happen. We'll see about that.

Ryan V.

Ryan
TP students petition for separate tables
April 26, 2008 | 08:01 AM

Ryan, I couldn't agree with you more. I am embarrassed as an adult that it took a 13 year old boy to bring up what I and many other adults have talked about but never did anything about. I have a 7th grader at Prairie View and a 5th grader at McAuliffe, which by the way does the same thing. As it is, the kids at Praire View can't even sit with their friends during lunch unless they are in the same tip class, but the school gives a separate table to a select few because of religious beliefs. I think it is outrageous the way our school district and many others are discriminating against the students, not to mention the majority of students and they are getting away with it! I thought government and religion were supposed to be kept separate? By giving the Muslim's their own lunch table because of religious beliefs, that is bringing religion into the public school system. I am not only a parent in this district, but I am also a Catholic. Mr. Martin, here is a piece of information for you. Not only do the Catholic's not eat meat on Friday's during Lent, they also give something up they like for the full 40 days of Lent. Quite often for a child of the Catholic faith that means something like pop, candy, or chocolate. How can you sit there and judge whit is more tempting to one person than another? Like Ryan, I too giv the Muslim's alot of credit for following their faith and fasting for the length of time they do. I don't think I would be able to do it either. However, it is their choice and it is a religious choice at that. If people do not like the basic rules that are set out for everyone in our public school system, then they do have the choice to go to a private school such as a Catholic school or a Muslim school where their religion is practiced throughout the school day. Furthermore look at the message you are sending our children. You are telling them that what is good for one select group is not good for everyone. The rules don't apply to everyone. That is wrong! So Ryan, I am urging other parents that feel the same way to come forward and attend the next school board meeting on May 15,2008 at 7:00 p.m. at Kirby School District. Maybe if enough of us get together and speak out we can change things. Ryan, my family is behind you 100%. GOOD JOB!

Jennifer
segregation
April 26, 2008 | 06:08 PM

This is what happens when a public institution tries to make accommodations for any religious practice. People are free to practice their religion, but it is not the job of the state nor of the school district to make it easier, harder, or in any way intrude on or accommodate religious practices.
The argument can be made that if a practice is supposed to be a sacrifice, it should be difficult, and so no accommodations should be made. However, that is passing judgment on a religious practice and is therefore not a position the state or the school district should take.
No accommodation should be made in the public school system for anyone’s religion whether it is the predominant religion or a minority religion.

Tim
July 27, 2008 | 08:57 PM

I am a parent of 2, who will be attending district 140, and i couldn't agree with Ryan enough! Hopefully this will get solved!

New to the town
July 27, 2008 | 08:57 PM

I am a parent of 2, who will be attending district 140, and i couldn't agree with Ryan enough! Hopefully this will get solved!

New to the town
The controversy here...
July 28, 2008 | 09:44 AM

Tim says that no concessions should be made for religious grounds in public schools. Wrong. They have to make concessions as long as they don't cost the taxpayers any money - or else they can get sued. That's why they did it - they don't want to be sued.

This is why Prairie View created the "Ramadan Table." Not because of a "good deed" as reported in that liberal rag, but because of the threat of lawsuit. They got advice from their legal counsel.

Now, had the school district made the same concessions to the Catholic kids, it would have been a non issue. But instead, they ignored the kids. Ryan had to write TWO articles to be heard. Then the arrogant school board finally "allowed" the lenten table. Why? Because they have to. Or else they could be sued.

They tried to bury the story. They had a meeting where they already deigned to give the kids their table (after they talked to their lawyer - and isn't that a violation of the fair an open meetings act?) Along with the agenda was a copy of the liberal rag's so-called editorial. It was entitled "Lent and Ramadan Not The Same." They are EXACTLY the same. Fasting for religious purposes. The school board also elected to have the cowardly anonymous comments copied as well and then the school board president had the gall to "commend" Ryan for bringing up the issue. The issue was forced by this newspaper or else they would have ignored them.

The editorial also inferred that it was the parents who initiated this lent table business. Like parents had nothing to do with the Ramadan table.

I was at the meeting. The arrogance of this school board is not to be believed. I urge anyone who has kids in 140 to VOTE these people off the school board. These are the people who YOU HAVE VOTED IN to be in charge of the school district.

Yes, they can have their Ramadan table. They should be able to talk about Ramadan. But others should be able talk about Christmas and Lent. There is no law against religion in schools, contrary to popular belief. There is a mandate against FORCING prayer. Big difference.

And a biased editorial that calls a 13 year old a "racist" because he wants a table for lent has no place at a school board meeting.

My kids are out of 140. I feel sorry for anyone whose kids are entering the school district. Get off your sofas, turn off American Idol and vote the school board out of office.

Michelle Williams

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